I have Obsidian synced into DT3 myself.
Is syncing Obsidian in the cloud OK? I heard doing so is not recommended, there is risk of file corruption or something similar.
I personally sync my obsidian files through folder sync with CCC, but I also have them indexed in DT, and they seem to be doubling up lately.
Have you any issues like this?
By chance using Appleās iCloud with the setting on Mac(s) to optimise disk space is turned on?
Do you sync your Devonthink/Obsidian data to a different computer?
Are there any problems with Obsidian as you move from machine to machine?
As for DT, I use the Mac as main machine, so I have all the documents stored there.
iPhone: only quick reference, so I have few small groups downloaded in the background, and all the other ones on demand.
iPad: only as a companion, so I have the Inbox database always full synced because I use that database for read later too, then I have the same groups of then iPhone automatically downloaded, and all the other ones on demand.
As for Obsidian, Iām full Apple so I use the default iCloud folder and its subfolders.
I use it on Mac, iPhone and iPad seamlessly and without any worries after many months of testing.
The sync is very fast, I work mainly on the Mac, but when I open up the iPad all the notes are synced very fast and can work with it almost instantaneously.
Will I ever come back full DT?
I donāt know, there many features in Obsidian that gives me much less friction than DT.
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Sorry, I might have made my question on this thread uncelar.
I donāt use the cloud to sync obsidian or databases. Thatās why I was asking.
But Iām talking about duplicate indexed files after syncing on another thread. But my sync method excludes cloud services.
I was just asking if it was safe to do so, as Obsidian community does not recommend doing so.
If you use the paid sync option in Obsidian, itās actually full e2ee, so you can set a encryption password and all documents are encrypted before syncing to their service. Thatās what Iām using as well
Thanks for that insight, I didnāt realise that. But again, I think I didnāt make my question clear. I meant safe, as in, no corruption of files etc. Poor choice of words.
Also, I bought an SSD for the very reason of not having to pay yearly subscription fees for all the cloud services there are. They tend to add up!
Same. Iām going to comment fully on this thread at the moment, but I wanted to add a comment that I think having an automatic Readwise import is not helpful for some people. I.e. donāt just turn it on because Obsidian can!
I save lots of random things to Readwise and Reader (Iām a beta tester), and I donāt want that ending up in Obsidian/DT. I do a manual import of what I intentionally choose to put in my database (the manual import goes straight to DT).
I also personally think itās dangerous to just import book highlights without processing them first. My workflow has a specific task of importing and processing the file with the highlights - adding notes, deleting bits Iāve now decided arenāt relevant, etc. If all this stuff just automatically entered my database I wouldnāt see it and itās value would be limited. Itās the sitting down, fleshing out the highlights, thinking, that makes these highlights useful to Future me.
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I downloaded Obsidian this summer and bought a yearās subscription to the sync function (I play on iPad a lot) so that I could test it out, and mostly I just donāt see how it adds value to my ways of working.
I had intended to use it for āoriginal notesā, I.e. my thoughts on the files that sat in DT. This is how Iāve seen many people use Obsidian + DT together.
Iāve mostly concluded it is a waste of time.
I do like their markdown editor. I find graph view pointless most of the time (I rarely link notes, thatās what search is for!).
Iām also not keen on indexing my obsidian vaults. This is because my main DT database has groups arranged by topic. I would far prefer the individual notes Iāve got in Obsidian to appear in the correct group. Because of this, I created several vaults (which is itself a nuisance as I have to switch vaults), but itās not an adequate solution.
I also found unnecessary friction between switching from DT to Obsidian, and just couldnāt see enough value to overcome it. E.g. even though Iāve been testing Obsidian since summer, more new notes have been created in DT than Obsidian, because I was already in DT and it was far easier to just stick a markdown note in the group I was already in rather than switch to another app.
The only thing I felt Obsidian added value for was managing a quotes āvaultā, which I wasnāt happy with in DT, and Iāve actually since found a better way to do that too. Thereās a delightful free markdown app called Notenik that has prebuilt templates for certain types of notes, include a ācommonplace bookā template. Itās perfect for storing quotes, stores the text files natively and can be indexed with DT. I wish Iād had it years ago and think itās perfect for quote management!
So all in all, my experiment with Obsidian was not a success. I would perhaps use Obsidian as my main ādatabaseā if I had found it before DT - and I can certainly see itās value as an app - but whilst itās hard to predict what an alternate universe me wouldāve done, I think I wouldāve still ended up in DT eventually because I handle different file types and interact with them and DT just doesnāt care what I put in it 
Having said all of that, their forum is good for ideas and I like to lurk and make changes to my DT setup as a result!
Obviously this is all just my own view, and I am not criticising Obsidian as an app, as itās beautiful and can do a lot! I think I mostly conclude itās a step backwards (for me) from DT.
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I like the dicussion in this forum.
I am also conflicted about these apps. One major advantage of Obsidian over Devonthink is the presence of an Android app. I am pleased to have my notes in my hand (android phone) so that I can browse, read, annotate etc while on the go.
One the disadvantage is the presence of huge chasm between my pdf materials (which reside inside DT) and my notes. DT is indispensable on this regard because I can connect, search and do whatever you want across your while knowledge base (which includes the pdf articles, books, web snippets etc).
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It is true: links tell little about the nature of the connection. Have you come up with a method encode this information?
Hey there,
I am one of those who would like a bit more Obsidian / Logseq / Noteplan - like features in Devonthink as well. In other words, I would love certain features in the Markdown Editor and free arrangement of the palettes on the right (info, incoming and outgoing links, etc.).
It seems that the developers are already more than busy with other updates and keeping the software up to date, and I appreciate the responsiveness.
Still, I am a bit sad about the more or less uncomfortable note-taking abilities. Of course, one can open any Markdown or Text Editor to work on the notes ā and I use this feature. Also, I could ā and did ā create vaults for the above-mentioned note-taking apps and use their options.
I understand that Devonthink was not created as a note-taking app; it is a trend that started later.
But I think it is important for Devonthink to stay with the primary trend in working with a Mac to be more ānote-taking friendly.ā Why?
I can imagine that many users would like to put their notes not just in a limited vault as indexed files but rather work in their database with notes and data collected or archived. At least, this is my approach. I had to decide between the comfort of the note-taking apps mentioned above and the comfort and reliability of Devonthink. It is a no-brainer, after all, to choose Devonthink.
But I would love to pay for a new version of Devonthink Pro for the features given in NotePlan and flexible info panels.
So far, from a user since 2003,
Maria
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There are possibilities.
If DocumentB supports DocumentA, you could tag DocumentB with DocumentA/support.
The tag bar can get crowded, particularly since hierarchy isnāt shown in the tag bar.
You could create a group called DocumentA_map and then replicate documents into subgroups of that. DocumentB could be replicated to DocumentA_map/support, for example.
Or, if you want to get edgy and have groups that can only contain replicants, thatās what tags are. It is safe (and reversible) to set the āexclude from taggingā option on a tag. Then, instead of adding that tag (since you canāt), replicate documents to the excluded tag.
Create tags like DocumentA/support, DocumentA/utter nonsense, etc. If you donāt want them cluttering up your tag bar, exclude some or all of those tags and subtags from tagging.
Iāve today donāt favour this way of storing notes because, despite outstanding search options eg in DT, I donāt like for my notes to become conceptually siloed. I used to follow your organisation, but ended up never referring back to notes once any project or topic had been temporarily exhausted; and as a result, often forgot about having them there in the first place. Now, having notes in a flatter folder structure, and putting them together in different ways and orderings, helps me think through problem and plan for writing projects. I think the switch for me here was from the āstudent mindsetā (which in my case lasted a long time!), where once you complete an assignment, youāll never need it again, to a āresearcher mindsetā, where work done years ago many suddenly become key again.
But of course, if you stay on top on your material, and search like a pro, yours will work just a well I bet!
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The graph view did little for me. I recently discovered a use ā in Obsidian I make many so-called āorphanā or āzombieā notes by creating a [[link to them]] without clicking and actually creating the file. They are there for future me. Iāve now added a line of custom CSS to colour them all yellow, and the graph reminds me visually what I once thought was worth a note. This helps me decide what to turn to next, especially if I see clusters of notes leading to a single never-created note.
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How exactly are you doing your research projects now?
My method was also similar to MsLogica and Amontilladoās (not very refined as Amontilladoās, but very close).
My method was to dedicate a group for my specific writing project. Assume I want to write an article about topicX, I would setup a couple of smart searches that scan my database for relevant terms (tags, words etc) to scan and collect the docs to that folder.
- if I find additional notes or articles that those smart searches fail to catch, I will tag them with some project related terms so that the searches will catch them. I would also use the AI to get more relevant items.
Once I have all my resources in a group, I will think about the ideas covered in them (usually be drawing graphs in Scapple). I make some hunches to solve the main problem there. I will look for missing information, if there is additional material I want to read etc, by looking at the materials I have in the group(folder). As I read more papers on the topic, the group would contain more material, and the ideas will develope to a certain directionāeither they will contradict or support my hunch. I wrote those hunches in Scapple, and use different arrows to indicate contradictinng and supporting ideas. Finally, when I think that I have a good proposal, I will drag those hunches and snippets I have in Scapple to Scrivener.
That was my workflow for a long time. I use DT for organizign the relevant materisls, and use Scapple for thinking, and Scrivener for drafting. I sometimes draft within DT as well.
Can you elaborate how you do your organzation of relevant materials, thinking and writing using Obsidian?
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This very similar to what I do ā and yours a really sound approach! I think that what ānoteā means differs for us a little.
DT contains all resources (PDF, images), often drawn into a project group by smart groups. It ALSO contains any project output: sometimes planning files (outlines, Scapple docs, mind maps), partial, full, edited drafts, and published final work, and so on.
Obsidian contains all reading notes (often, my reflections and processed reading/thinking on the resources stored in DT), broken down into concept, people, and reading notes (the latter tend to be longer, and break down an entire book, journal article, etc). Some of these are organised into larger structure notes (e.g. the āEnglish Civil Warā might have 10s of notes linked to it, of events, people, related concepts).
Then when I come to write the outputs that are stored in DT (like you, long form in Scrivener), I will refer to my āknowledgeā stored in Obsidian about the texts, people, concepts, or reading. Iāll draw the resources from DT.
On a good day, some writing emerges. On a bad day, I fiddle with my apps or spend more time on tech forums than is good for me ā when I should be writingā¦ 
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I was trying to squeez my mind what those links and organizations in Obsidian can help you for the actual writing. My undersanding is that the links connecting the notes will not make it into the actual paper you are going to write. Do they?
@SebMacV and @Dellu I find how you use smart groups very strategic, and it solves my doubt: how do I organise my contents without siloing them?
It makes sense, maybe I can test it in place of Obsidian.
As for backlinks (in Obsidian), I use them for for the followings:
-
to let some cues to my future self (I donāt mind of orphan links: they are fine)
-
to relate one note to another one in order to remember to leave to my future self some context I donāt need right now, but maybe Iāll need in the future
-
to relate one note to another one In order to build a path, a chain of thoughts
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I donāt sort by project, but by topic. It is fairly top level: I have 3 main fields of interest (thus 3 groups), then slightly more narrow sub-topics within these groups. Some sub-topics are very big so then I get quite granular. This could go on for quite a while so Iāve implemented a 4 tier rule.
My issue for Obsidian is my vaults are at the top folder level, but I want my Obsidian beaver water notes in the beaver water quality folder. If I did set vaults up at the subfolder level Iād end up with lots of vaults and isnāt practical.
I donāt worry much about my note files mingling, prompting new ideas, and that stuff. I like navigating by folders but I use search a lot and usually scan through what DT has picked up in case thereās anything interesting.
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