(That is, I believe this happened with the update to DEVONthink 4.3; in any case, it’s certainly true of 4.3 and I can’t seem to correct it.)
I like to keep my applications windows set to an optimal layout on-screen when I’m working with more than one application. I also regularly use window management tools like Moom (currently at 4.5) to resize and move things around to create a workspace that allows me to keep different application windows open and displayed on the screen just-so, so that I can move back and forth with minimal clicking on an app’s window to bring it forward before I start typing.
For years I’ve depended on DEVONthink’s habit (I would call it a feature) to, once a single database window is open and set to the preferred dimensions, to then open any subsequent windows to those dimensions. This makes doing things like placing windows side-by-side on a large monitor easy: set the first window to 1/4 of the screen size and you can position up to three other windows in a tiled configuration.
This longstanding trait of DT seems to have been broken in DT 4.3. I can resize a window to the dimensions I want but the next window to open will do so to a size I’ve not set, seemingly arbitrary in width in particular. If I resize this new, oddly-sized window back to the size I want it, sometimes the Inspectors pane becomes partly hidden, rather than the old behavior of narrowing the column in list view. DT 4.3 no longer respects the special green radio button panel that Moom imposes, allowing me to resize the window to a defined fraction of the screen: when I do so, DT snaps its windows to a different size, again, one that I’ve not chosen. If I quit DT and reopen it database windows that were open before quitting change from their previous dimensions to, again, dimensions that I’ve not set.
In short, DT 4.3 doesn’t seem to remember window sizes or positions, at least in databases’ list views; it doesn’t respect manual resizing of windows, or it does so irregularly; it doesn’t respect Moom, one of the most common of the window management applications.
It’s a small issue, one might say, but it really slows down my work in multi-windowing environments and it spoils the aesthetics of layouts I’ve worked hard to develop.
DT did adhere to Moom until v 4.3, at least for the last several years.. If I quit Moom, DT 4.3 continues to show the changes in window behavior I listed in my posting.
Yes, I’m on Tahoe 26.5; sorry, I should have mentioned that. It’s possible that a Tahoe update is the culprit of the change in DT behavior – I upgraded to DT 4.3 and Tahoe 26.5 about the same time – but I’m pretty sure it’s not a DT/Tahoe/Moom issue, as it happens when Moom is not running; it would seem to be a DT or DT/Tahoe issue.
No, I’m usually on a large monitor but not an ultrawide or 4K. And the problem is reproduceable when I’m using no external monitor. (That is, running on only my 14" MacBook Pro.)
I understand that DT’s adherence to Moom’s resizing options was, as you said, “coincidental,” but in my experience Moom has worked with every app I’ve ever thrown at it, including DT, so this sudden change in window behavior came as a surprise. And Moom’s resizing features work as before on every app I’ve tried after upgrading to Tahoe, except for DT.
I’ve not noticed an issue with Moom and DT and use it daily, but I don’t open multiple windows of DT at once most the time. But I will try your use-case tomorrow and report back.
It doesn’t really mean anything but the only app I’ve had problems consistently using with Moom is InDesign, which ignores any settings and does what it likes (probably par for the course with Adobe to be honest ).
Thanks for giving this a try. I suspect that you’re right about Adobe: their current app UIs ignore or break all manner of stuff. John Gruber had a good piece on this in early May, citing a recent column by Nick Heer on what’s actually under the UI hood for the Adobe suite – Daring Fireball: Adobe’s ‘Modern’ User Interface Is Just Webpages
Ugh. As Gruber points out, it wasn’t always this way: Adobe’s apps in the 1990s were models of the native Mac UI’s elegance.
DT and Moom seem to be behaving as expected for me this morning. I’ve tried opening two windows, and the command palette works as expected (mine like yours is set to appear when I hover over the green re-size dot on windows). I’ve got a couple of saved custom windows for DT and they’re working, and DT re-opens on the last settings used if I close a window then re-open one. I’ve tested both on my ultra wide monitor (my default) and my MBP monitor and the behaviour is normal for both.
I’m on Tahoe 26.5 and most my apps are up to date. However I’ve just noticed I’ve actually not renewed Moom, I think they asked for a new licence for Tahoe? I’m running 4.3, and it looks like the current version is 4.5.
4.5 is the latest version of Moom and, as I recall, there were significant changes between the two versions. But, as I noted, the erratic window sizing I’m seeing in DEVONthink occurs whether or not Moom is running. I’m not sure I can eliiminate Moom entirely from the equation but DT is the only application that is showing this behavior, with or without Moom running in the background.
I have exactly the same problem. Window position/layout is no longer saved (starting with version 4.3). Worse yet, when dragging (to resize) on the right side, DT is extremely slow to adjust the position (as if it can’t keep up with the calculations).
This is definitely a DT issue, since I don’t experience this with other apps. I also reinstalled version 4.3 (no change). I haven’t tried a complete uninstallation and reinstallation yet.
Right now, it’s hindering my work, since I always have to reposition the window when I start the app. I’ve also tried different settings in the preferences, but I always have the same problem when starting up.
Additional concern: My (upgrade) license is valid for another 30 days, and I’m worried that this “defect” version will be my last one. Version 4.2 would be fine for me, but where can I get it?
Does this fix the issue? Version 4.3 didn’t change anything related to window sizing, especially as this is completely handled by macOS. DEVONthink defines only min or max window sizes.
Thanks for the link. I installed version 4.2.2 and STILL HAVE THE SAME PROBLEM. So it’s NOT DT’s fault. Sorry.
After that, I completely uninstalled DT (using App Cleaner), leaving a system without the library, etc. I reinstalled DT, but I still have the same problem. I don’t know what it could be, since I hadn’t changed anything on the Mac system and the problem only occurs with DT. Apparently, it was the last Mac system update on 26.5 . I’ve been testing a bit more and have noticed the following:
I have two monitors (MBP + LG 49" widescreen (5120x1140)). The LG is my main screen and the MBP is the extended screen. When I set the MBP as the main screen (LG = extended screen), everything works as usual. So it’s perfect. But when the LG is the main screen, it messes up the DT UI. The laptop alone, without the LG, also works great. I’ve already performed a DCC reset on both monitors, but it didn’t help. Of course, I’ve also tried all the possible settings in Apple’s Display menu… No solution.
I hope I’m not confusing things too much in this thread, but it’s the same problem as in the first post.
Yeah, I agree - I’m still having global shortcut issues with the 26.5 update. Okay, sorry again for suspecting you guys, but DT was the only program where the problem occurred. I also use third-party software (1Piece + MonitorControl), but they weren’t the cause. I tested DT 4.2.2 on a new user account without any third-party software, and I also ran a completely fresh installation of DT without sync, old databases, etc.
The issue may well be due to something amiss in the latest iteration of Tahoe; it definitely emerged in my use of DT around the time I upgraded to both macOS 26.5 and DEVONthink 4.3. But I’m still seeing these window resizing anomalies only in DT. I use a good dozen or more other apps pretty intensively every day and I’ve not seen this issue in any of them. Admittedly, I’m using DT particularly intensively right now for a large, complex writing project, but if the problem were only Tahoe I would think it would be more widespread …?
Yes, most of the time my 14-inch MacBook Pro (M3 Pro) is connected to a larger external monitor. But I’ve encountered these window resizing anomalies on the laptop without an external monitor.
I can confirm that the issue is probably not Tahoe-related. I am experiencing the same issue with DTP v4.3 (not any other program). I am running macOS Sequoia 15.7.7 and Moom v4.5. I sent a bug report last evening.
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