Can't find (working) DT database

I’m sure this will be the dumbest question ever, but…
DT is working, I wanted to back up the DB, I’ve searched my entire hard drive, Dropbox folder, Dropbox cloud, iCloud for “DevonThink” and all I an find is the program DEVONthink 3.app and DevonThink Packet Sync (contains Dropbox.dtCloud with zero bytes). Similarly I have searched and ".dtBase " “.dtBase2” and “.dtBase3” and found nothing.

If the database is working, the Data → Show in Finder command in DT will reveal the current document. From there, you can work your way up the path to see where the database is stored.

File > Database Properties shows the location of a database.

And I would guess you’re referring to the Global Inbox @MichaelW. That’s ~/Library/Application Support/DEVONthink 3/Inbox.dtBase2.

If you want to backup your database(s), there’s a Daily Backup Archive script in the scripts menu (in the Export folder).

Thanks Bluefrog, that was helpful.
I was rather surprised to find it as you suggest located at user > Library > Application Support > Devonthink3 > Inbox.dtBase2. I certainly would not have consciously put it there or even known how to and the manual (which I followed) advises that to get started, create a new DB and “Give your database an easily recognizable name, and choose where you want to save your database. We advocate putting them in a folder in your home directory, like ~/Databases.” I would certainly have put the DB within my local DropBox folder (that is auto backed up). Where it is now is outside my Time Machine backup.
Rather than try to move the datafile I decided just to set up a backup script as recommended by troejgaard, but this saves to the same place and the manual does not suggest the location can be changed.
Any suggestions on how to make an auto-backup to a location that is backed up?
Thanks again, much appreciated.

Thanks kewms, that was helpful.
BTW your tip only works when a file is selected within DT, not the inbox or any folder (command greyed out).

Thanks, that was helpful, although the script saves to the same folder as the datafile (user > Library > Application Support > Devonthink3 > Inbox.dtBase2), which is outside both my Time Machine and DropBox backups and the manual does not suggest the location can be changed.

Really? I don’t think, AFAIK, excluding that folder user > Library > Application Support > Devonthink3 > is excluded by default. If my recollection is correct, then is there a reason why excluded on your machine? Perhaps simply do not exclude that folder? And perhaps other folders in that folder tree also should be backed up?

Thanks for the idea. On the computer User > Library is hidden by default (access via Go > Option) and does not appear in the TimeMachine directory, nor can Go be used to access it in the Time Machine directory, so I’m guessing it’s not there or at least not accessible.

The directory certainly exists - invisibility ≠ non-existence :slight_smile:

In the Finder, hold the Option key and choose Go > Library to get to the User Library in the least obtrusive way. (PS: This is not a new mechanism.)

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What is the “TimeMachine” directory?

The list of files in a Time machine backup, accessed in Finder by choosing a back up file on the Time Machine hard drive.

Hi, the file may exist in the Time Machine backup, but Go > Library shows the file on the local hard drive not the Time Machine hard drive.
In context, I was seeking a way to auto-backup DT to an external drive and rmschne suggested that the files would be by default included in a Time Machine backup. However, to restore eg just the DT database I have to be able to find the file within a Time machine backup and this I cannot do as Go > Library goes to the local drive version of the folder.

So much run-around here suggests I haven’t communicated clearly. I want to auto backup DT to an external drive. Currently DT saves to the Library. Could I not just copy the files to my Documents folder and then from DT Open those files? (and delete the originals). The DropBox would handle the backup.

Well, I can’t see into your TimeMachine backups.

From what you say, and I cannot confirm this, if a folder exists on file system but “hidden” by whatever reason (Apple’s or user’s decision), then perhaps true that it will also be hidden on the files in TimeMachine. I can’t test that hunch now.

However, unless you specifically excluded it from TimeMachine Backups the folder ~/Library will be backed up. This of course includes the DEVONthink Application Support folder where Inbox is kept. Apple explains how to exclude folders at

Re seeing hidden folders and files, see

https://www.autodesk.com/support/technical/article/caas/sfdcarticles/sfdcarticles/How-to-Access-Hidden-User-Library-folder-on-Mac-OS.html

where you can get more info on how to view those folders Apple chose to “hide” by default. I can only guess why Apple hides that or any other folders. I’m sure they have their reasons but that is of not real interest to me since years ago I set the AppleShowAllFiles to YES as described in the above article. There are many other places on the internet where the same is explained. Perhaps if you set that you can see those hidden folders more reliably?

Edit:

Some more articles I located with internet search “does timemachine backup hidden folders” which may help you:

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/8038868

There are others.

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@MichaelW I’m finding this whole thread a bit confusing and I’m wondering if there isn’t some misapprehension regarding the Global Inbox. The database named " Inbox.dtBase2" is automatically generated by DEVONthink and is not supposed to be altered or moved. It is NOT supposed to be used as a main working database. The DEVONthink manual states:

when you launch DEVONthink, you will immediately see a database called Inbox. This is a special database and a core component of the software. As a core database, you can’t delete or close it, as it provides an always open database for quickly storing unfiled or transient data.
Imagine you are reading about fission reactions and someone sends a link about a vacation place in Bali. You jump to the website and quickly clip a webarchive of the page. But instead of putting it in your research database, you add it to the Global Inbox and get back to work. You can go back later and read or sort things to other databases. If you are familiar with Getting Things Done you’ll recognize the concept.
The Global Inbox is also special as it is the only database you can add a shortcut to in the Finder’s sidebar. This allows you to save a file into the Global Inbox from other applications. All databases also have an Inbox group with the same purpose as the Global Inbox. It just allows you to save unfiled data to a more specific database, as needed.

Ordinary databases – the ones we create ourselves – should normally go in your home directory, as you stated above. Those will be the databases in which you permanently store your work. Those are the databases that you really need to back up, because material should not really be kept in the Inbox for any length of time.

I really would recommend reading the manual because I get the impression that there are some incorrect assumptions lurking in the background.

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Yes, I think you are right. Yes a number of misconceptions from the start.

The OP expressed surprise that the Inbox.dtBase2 was in ~/Library/Application Support/DEVONthink 3/Inbox.dtBase2. Appears to think this an active database, as you suggest–this is not advised, of course. And since in OP’s view since that hidden folder “outside TimeMachine and Dropbox backups” that all the more a reason to be “surprised” about that location for working databases.

  • Inbox.dtBase2 not intended to be the working database. But does hold the Global Inbox
  • Inbox.dtBase2 is indeed backed up by TimeMachine unless excluded specifically by the user (which is the point I was trying to convey)
  • Putting DEVONthink databases in a Dropbox sync folder not a good idea. I don’t know where that documented, but recall discussed here in this forum often.
  • Putting DEVONthink databases in a folder inside the user’s home folder, e.g. ~/DEVONthink, and then relying on TimeMachine to back them up is in my opinion a good idea.
  • Relying on Dropbox sync folders for backup not prudent, in my opinion for reasons discussed ad nasueum here.
  • The DEVONthink Manual has a whole section on backups (page 19 of 3.9.8 Version)

I’m probably adding to the confusion, but not intending to.

I agree with @mbbntu, I’m also confused about the confusion and suspect @MichaelW has some basic misapprehensions.

I have my databases in ~/Databases like suggested in the manual. I’m not sure if I created this folder myself, since that would be 10+ years back, but in my distant memory DEVONthink created that folder automatically.

This also confuses me, since on my machine the script creates a zip archive in the folder ~/Backup, which I did not have before running the script. It creates an archive for each the selected open database, including the Global Inbox. (Edit: Misremembered, it’s been a while since I used this. But it can be changed to repeat with all open DBs.) It did that on my old Intel machine, and it does the same on my newer M1 machine. And I did not use migration assistant. Neither have I modified the script in any way.

Michael, you mention Dropbox several times… I just wanted to make sure. I hope you are not talking about your normal Dropbox folder!? As mentioned in the manual and many times on the forum, you should NOT put your databases in a cloud folder. (Unless we are talking about a zipped archive).

Recently someone mentioned that Dropbox has launched a new feature/service specifically for backup, so that might be what you are talking about.

(Edit to add, since I and @rmschne replied at the same time:)

On page 12, in the Getting Started chapter under Building your database. It is even formatted to stand out from the rest of the text: “Note: You cannot create or store a database in a cloud-synced folder, e.g., iCloud Drive or Dropbox. […]

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Seems a few rabbit holes have been explored…
My original issue was that I wanted to have a restorable copy of my DT DB on a separate hard drive or cloud, to cover the risk of drive failure/computer loss. After consulting the manual, I couldn’t see how to do this. I couldn’t even find the DB.
Surely all experienced DT users have dealt with this issue?
So, the information I wanted (but obviously failed to make clear) was:
How do I make and preferably automate a backup to another location?
I very much appreciate all the contributions, but so far I have made zero progress.

I have never had trouble finding my databases because I have always kept them in a folder called “Databases” in my User folder – as suggested in various places.

I still don’t have a clear idea of where you are keeping your databases from what you have written. However, to deal with the question of backing up, I have always used three methods:

  1. A subscription to Backblaze (which is a very modest cost): Cloud Backup: Easy, Secure, Unlimited Online Backup
  2. Carbon Copy Cloner, which is a well-respected and much recommended backup utility: https://bombich.com
  3. Time Machine.

If our data is important to us, there is sense in using the old system of having at least three copies of our data in three different locations. The strategy I have outlined above does not give three geographical locations, but it does use two hard drives, plus the cloud. If I include the original on my computer hard drive, I have four copies of my data – and that means all of it, not just DEVONthink databases.

HTH.

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