Invisible sorting

[shiiko]

I use TheBrain app which allows their Folders to be organized by the prefacing of numbers that are ‘invisible’ within the Folder name. The numbers inserted as .1 name; .2 name; .3 name; etc. This allows me to force an order that is not visible when I make a crosslink or search.

In other words, with a list of Thoughts:

Apple
Banana
Cranberry

These will normally sort alphabetically.

But with TheBrain I can invisibly sort them:

.1 Banana
.2 Cranberry
.3 Apple

Another important aspect is that when I search or create a link I don’t see the preface, but see only the name.

In DT4, if I desire to impose the same type of order, I have to either order by Rating. Or I can place a number ahead of the item.

1 Banana
2 Cranberry
3 Apple

The second method sorts by the number but then creates a problem when searching for the item, because now a fast search for Banana will have to start with 1.

Hope that this make sense so far.

Question: Is there a way to place a hidden sorting order in DT4 documents? Or any other suggestion to invisibly sort items?

Thanks.

[manfred9]

You could create a custom field and number the sequence of the items. There are some scripts in the forum how to achieve the numbering very easily.

[rkaplan]

No script needed to sort by a custom metadata field - just add it as one of your visible columns and then click on the field title to sort it as ascending vs descending.

[troejgaard]

@shiiko

The second method sorts by the number but then creates a problem when searching for the item, because now a fast search for Banana will have to start with 1.

What? That doesn’t make sense.
How are you searching?

[manfred9]

You are right of course. The reference to the scripting was for applying the numbering to the custom field. I didn’t express that very well.

[BLUEFROG]

No you can’t assert a hidden sorting order in DEVONthink. Choose View > Sort > Unsorted and manually drag items into the order you want.

[shiiko]

Thanks @BLUEFROG @rkaplan

I suspect the unsorted method does not keep its sort order indefinitely. The custom metadata adds a column when necessary to sort (screen real estate is tight), but it is persistent. So a combination of the two solutions is the best solution for me. Thanks!

PS: Would be nice to be able to tighten the column spacing or alignment for this column. But the developers have bigger fish to fry. Thanks for DT4, it is awesome!

[BLUEFROG]

You’re welcome.

Double-clicking a column separator changes the column’s width to accommodate the widest value.

[shiiko]

Sorry to fuss about this, but would it be possible that Ascending sorted items be placed at the top of the document list? Right now the sorted items are shown at the bottom of the document list. As shown in the image.

[cgrunenberg]

@shiiko

Right now the sorted items are shown at the bottom of the document list.

While it might not be useful for your usage scenario, the current sorting is intended and consistent as the items without a value equal 0.

[dansroka]

@shiiko

I suspect the unsorted method does not keep its sort order indefinitely.

I use unsorted exclusively, and find it very stable.

If you sort (e.g. by name) and then return to unsorted, your unsorted order is remembered.

[FrankT]

@dansroka

I use unsorted exclusively, and find it very stable.

You seem to be a rare specimen. One like me.

That’s right, it’s absolutely stable.

But in this “mode”, I would like to see a new document created directly above (or below) the selected one. You too?

Or how do you organize it?

[dansroka]

We are rare, but special!

I would like to see a new document created directly above (or below) the selected one. You too?

Oh, good point. Either directly above or below a selection would be very helpful. I always forget that it defaults new docs to the bottom of the list and “lose” it.

[FrankT]

@dansroka

Either directly above or below a selection would be very helpful

But since you and I are the only ones using this mode …

But if we weren’t the only ones. Then there would be plenty of room for improvement. Let’s say …

move a document by one position instead of manually with cmd+control+arrow up/down. Wouldn’t that be wonderful?

[dansroka]

A key command to move a doc up or down in an unsorted group would be nice…

[FrankT]

Let’s see if others see it the same way.

[analogue_man]

I agree. This could be helpful. Or an ability to script it via Keyboard Maestro, Alfred, whatever if development would consider this problematic for the menu/shortcut hygiene. I guess that could be an interesting ‚outliner mode‘

[FrankT]

@analogue_man

Or an ability to script it via Keyboard Maestro, Alfred, whatever

This is what it looks like in BTT. It works, but not the way it could work “natively”.

Edit: If anyone sees another option, perhaps apple script, that would be greatly appreciated (by many). Thanks in advance.

[FrankT]

A gimmick , this is done completely without a mouse, just with the keyboard.

[BLUEFROG]

Control + arrow keys are the defaults for Mission Control.