DTPO and iCloud Drive?

If I’m not using DTTG … and won’t be using my DTPO database on two computers at once … but mere want to keep my DTPO database in the cloud instead of on my hard drive, is there any reason I have to use Dropbox and should NOT use iCloud Drive?

DEVONtechnologies strongly recommends that you do not put databases in Dropbox, iCloud, or any other cloud storage. These services are not designed to manage the type of data storage that DEVONthink uses. Damage and lost data can and will occur. (Personally, I’ve had Dropbox render databases inoperable.)

You can index data in clouds. You can use Dropbox to sync data. These uses involve different data structures than databases.

Don’t take my word for it. Search and read the years of threads here on the topic.

korm is absolutely correct. These services are not data-safe for our databases. So, technically you are able do it, but it’s unsupported and dangerous behavior.

Thank you both for the warning.

Am I correct in assuming that if I want to transfer a DT database to another computer (and not just use a thumb drive), it’s okay to upload it to DropBox or ICloud Drive, “park” it there, NOT work on it when it’s in the cloud, but download it to the 2nd computer’s hard drive, work on it there, and when finished, upload it to the cloud so it can be downloaded by the first computer?

No. This is NOT safe. As stated, these mechanisms are NOT made for use with package files like ours. You should ONLY use our Sync plugin and one of its options. (Sorry, but iCloud is not supported in this case either.)

Wow. So if I want to transfer a file to another computer, thumb drive is the only way to go?

Umm… no. That is not what I said. It is one option - and even usable via the Sync plugin and a local syncStore on the thumbdrive. You could use a Direct Connection Sync or a remote Sync location (though they come with inherent weaknesses that must be considered. Do note that the local syncStore on an external is our most advocated often method though.)

Thanks for that. I guess I’m a little more confused than even I thought I was. Is there anything wrong with simply copying a DTPO database file to a thumb drive, then copying it onto another computer and opening it on that computer? When I set up my new computer, I just copied the file from the old and dragged it onto the new. Should I not have done that?

There’s no technical issue with it but it’s not an efficient way to do things. Using the Sync plugin and a local syncStore on teh thumbdrive would be far more efficient.

I’m looking for a way to have one central data repository that I can access from all my OS X and iOS devices. Basically, something roughly like Evernote, but not using Evernote (which I don’t like for various reasons).

I am so far using a DT database in iCloud that at least lets me access the data from my Macs, but now I’ve learned here that DT databases should only be stored locally, so I’ll need to change that.

The obvious mobile solution would seem to be DT to Go. However, that app appears to have limited functionality, stability issues, and creates a copy of the database (instead of accessing the same central repository as the desktop app). These limitations put DT to Go in its current form too far away from my intended solution to be attractive to me.

So, long story short: Is it correct that there is no way for me to use DT as a cloud-based solution (one repository, access from OS X and iOS devices over the Internet)? Assuming there isn’t, can I expect a solution from Devon in the future? And, assuming I can, will it arrive “eventually” or is there something more concrete to say about the schedule?

Sorry for the many questions, and thanks in advance for any information you can give me.

No, this is not possible and unlikely to change in the future. We subscribe to a decentralized data model where data is stored locally and Syncs to a commonly accessible location. (Consider what happens when you have no network access. How will you access your data when it’s only on someone else’s servers?)

Would this work, although it is not in line with your local/sync database philosophy: keep data [not database] in a folder on dropbox, icloud, etc. Then on each computer that you want to use the data have that computer’s DTPO index that folder. No syncing , but one has a local DTPO data base.

I don’t do this, just wondered if it might work as a point of curiosity.

@nishiazabu : Yeah - there’s no technical problem with that.

hi. this is essentially what i am doing. it works fine with spideroak, though there are lag issues that you probably won’t encounter with icloud.

as i am now working almost entirely with one computer (macbook) and mobile devices (ipad, iphone, and ipod), i no longer have any lag issues to worry about – it’s nice to have everything online and updated if i need to have something that hasn’t been synced to my ipad.

dttg doesn’t have any stability issues, as far as i can tell, but your mileage may vary. i actually don’t mind at all having the database replicated onto the ipad – it is a different model than evernote’s, because you aren’t (thankfully) running everything through a third party’s servers, so it does different stuff.

voodoopad was a nice app that had an osx and ios version syncing through dropbox quite smoothly and encrypted. it was really quite wonderful, especially for small numbers of items (called pages). but, as you got into the thousands or tens of thousands, things became quite troublesome, and sometimes things failed to sync. then, it turns out that the encryption was not implemented well until relatively recently. and, the development has basically stagnated with little hope of any significant progress in the future. in other words, syncing through the cloud like evernote (for example) could be done, and it has been done in the past, but it is fairly uncommon (even among plaintext apps on ios it is rare) and doesn’t yet seem to scale up very well (notesy on the ipad and scrivener or nvalt on the macbook seems to work the best among these apps).

An alternative to some of the commercial cloud folders like spideroak, dropbox, icloud, etc is Transporter Sync with your own harddrives. I have two of them in different physical locations where all the files are synced and duplicated.

The files also are synced to transporter folders on my various computers where I can access the files.

An option I use for some photo and video files is have the files on the two synced Transporter hard drives but not on my computers. I can still access the files and download them if I need them, but otherwise they do not take up harddrive space on my computers.

I have been using them about 2 years with no problems or corruption of data. These folders, being duplicated on different computers, can also be indexed by DTPO.

I don’t have a big need for security but some law firms who do, also use this type of approach.

The key to me is still to utilize the power of DTPO in a way that is frictionless to the user. I love its power and blow away my partners with its ability to find data that is relevant to questions that arise in the course of our consulting projects.

Current sync processes are not frictionless but I expect that to change in the future.

Very good suggestion.

I assume, then, that the path to these indexed files is the same on each Transporter, relative the root of the hard drive. How does your laptop know, or get told, which Transporter to access?

On a given computer, say my MBPro, I have a Transporter folder that has 2 aspects or functions.

It has a sub-folder which is really an “alias” '[terminology is mine not Connected Data’s, but I think you’ll get the idea] to the remote hard drives. It doesn’t matter which one, they are identical in contents. Thru this alias I can access and download to my MBPro the files which are stored on the remote Transporter drives. I DO need an Internet connection to get these files. BUT these are files I rarely use and just want copies somewhere in case I need them. So I can get them but they take up no space on my computer.

The other aspect of the Transport folder are the files which are stored on my remote hard drives AND locally on my MBPro. I do not need any internet connection to use these files. I only need a connection to sync them up with the remote disks. These are the files I use day to day in projects, for reference, etc.

Additionally I can use the Transporter icon on my ipad or iphone to access the same files. It acts as simply as using dropbox on a ipad.

A side benefit is that I use my own hard disks or SSD’s for the remote disks. So I can have multi terabyte storage at the cost of a new hard drive. The Transporter Sync is less than a $100 USD, as low as $79 on special. I heard about this a few years ago on a pod cast and tried it. Works nicely.

Hope this helps clarify a few points.

Just reread your question. The way I have been using it is that DTPO indexes the files on the local computer on which it is running. I have not checked to see what it does with the files which are only resident on the remote disks. I will test that and see what happens!

Thanks for the various suggestions.

I hadn’t considered storing just the files in the cloud and creating a local database on each device. However, it seems that this wouldn’t work on iOS devices, where I’d still have to use DT to Go, right? Also, it would not seem to sync metadata such as tags. Unless I’m mistaken about these limitations, this solution seems not to adequately support what I want to do.

Similarly, does the Transporter solution address iOS access? It seems I’d still be limited to DT to Go.

This wouldn’t be an issue with a database stored in iCloud, Dropbox, or any other service that automatically syncs with my local drive. The only consequence of being cut off from the net is that any required synching would be delayed until after network access is restored, but that is still no worse than a purely local database such as DT uses now.

Together does more or less what I want, it’s just less powerful and stable than desktop DT. I’d hoped it would be possible to get the best of both worlds.

@nishiazabu – thank you for taking time to explain the process. It is a good option for readers here who are not interested in commercial or public clouds. It appears that the data are encrypted in flight (see here) – so I assume the Transporter client on your laptop is handling the decryption seamlessly? Unfortunately, it looks like the low-end Transporter has been discontinued – there is in their store a 1TB unit (perhaps one can swap drives to make it’s capacity larger) but the next larger unit is 10x the price of the lower end unit. Amazon is selling some of the discontinued products, but that’s not a great bet from a support standpoint.

Interesting. It looks like Connected Data is focusing on the enterprise segment. I had not looked at their website for a year or more, since my equipment works so well. In the FAQ, there does appear to be information for compatibility information for swapping out the 1TB hard drive in the Transporter for a larger drive. support.filetransporter.com/article/AA-00303

A shame about discontinuing the T Sync. I’ll be running mine until they rust. I hope someone comes out with a similar consumer product again. Anyone out there? :smiley: